How to, Squad lead

Hi guys,
well i have been playing PR a while now and im looking to start squad leading infantry squad. One problem im not too great at it, so i was thinking maybe you guys who do a lot of squad leading could post some tips on leading infantry squads.
This could also help out anyone else who is looking to squad lead.
Cheers, Ghost.

yea dude i know the feeling i do try sumtimes, but the peeps id be leading are far greater sl' than i cud ever be so its hard and i mean really hard at the start( not to put a downer on it or nothin lol but good luck anyways )

Make sure every one has voip and can talk and full understand you

YOU tell them what kits to take , Dont be shy to tell some one to do something

I love leading squads providing they are not douche bags and are willing to listen to there SL

Just stick at it and you will soon learn the ropes

3 Tips I can give:

Explain the plan, or atleast what is relevant to your squad
Ensure you have the correct tools for the job
Ensure you stick to the plan and make sure your men stick to it

Ghost the best advice I can give you is to be yourself, each person leads in a different manner, whether it be tight and rigid or a loose formation with the SL only giving a general objetive to the squad. Just playing as SL will help you become an SL.

PS Don't be afraid to annoy your squad, its your squad not their's, plus they may be only seeing it from a vanilla perspective eg. Kills, rather than a carefully put together plan that may rely upon your squad sitting on your arses doing nothing!

Ghost if you ever around on teamspeak when I am feel free to remind me and I can give you some pointers. You need confidence more than anything matey! most people are just too scared to be SLs, they don't like the responsibility of having guys under them, A big thing that will help you is experience, stick with it and your learn how to do it over time for sure. Your'll need a plan and need to be aware of what your guys are doing and where you slot in the overall picture in the battle.

Don't feel afraid or embarrassed to tell people what to do its what the SL does and remember its your squad.

I simply don't have the attituide/personality for it.




I love taking orders

learn the basics and don't be afraid to ask your squad if you don't know, think, there are tons of SL's out there who don't even know how to use the radio !!! (at least you do)

then as sugs says be your self, leading other people comes from the thought that you have a plan, how you carry that is your business.

don't forget what PR is about and learn some military basics, PR isn't about special forces crap, it's about basic infantry doing basic infantry stuff.

start with squad members that you know, create>lock>invite.

some say "be strict etc etc" but if you want success let the squad members do the roles they prefer/are good at, that way you will have a squad that wants to do the job and come back for more.

I'll try and find some stuff for you to read but forget all that rubbish you can find on the net about 'gaming' war most of it is rubbish and the authors are well up their own arse.

basic military manuals for infantry are simple and easily read with easy concepts.

my final tip is weapons free at very nearly all times, the enemy are known (unlike real life) the enemy know you are enemy (unlike real life) so whats the the issue ? if your squad don't shoot back they will die, you will suffer confidence problems and eventually you'll shy away from the role.
fight your way to the objective or you will pay the price in the long run with success (success being your integrity as a leader at all times not someone who pulls off the occasional fluke)

hope this helps and can i get an invite?

speed

Something I'm guilty of is being too eager.

The beauty of PR is not necessarily about capturing the flag or destroying the cache. Its about enjoying the experience and the Team work. You'll find players appreciate good leadership, even if you spend much of the time defending in one position.

Patience is the key. Storming the objective will almost always end one way. Bide your time, observe the place you want to move into before advancing. Use a point man to protect the SL and the medic, in fact an SL should never lead an assault. Thats what your specialist and Rifleman are for.

Its hard to do with smurfs, but organisation is also key. Devide your squad up into teams of two. e.g, Specialist and Rifleman could be assaulters, Automatic rifleman and marksman provides covering fire support. SL and Medic provide direct support to the assaulting element.

Get your team to cover the corners at all times. Try not to think of the map as roads, rather lanes of fire. Set your team up when defending in a similar manner. What lane of fire are your team members looking after and how can you cover the most roads from a given position.

If you have to break contact and retreat dont just run. Move each pair in your team seperatly, while the other two pairs laying down covering fire as you move.

Happy to give tips one evening when I'm on.

For INFANTRY SLs:
Don't be afraid to kick people from your squad if they are not following orders, even *NwA* admins (especially *NwA* admins)
People DO want to play in a squad with a harsh squadleader, remarkably! Don't ask them, order them!
Know the difference between offence and defence, select squad weapons accordingly.
When Oscar-Mike, restrict squad chat to target + bearing + distance (ie "enemy RPG, SE 130, 200m")
MOVEMENT is the most fundamental skill to learn. Never stay in the same place for more than a minute (unless you are defending).
Don't take a knife to a gunfight. Only engage targets that you plan on, don't let your squad fire at anything they see. (Speed is talking shite here!) You need to be in control of a firefight. If the engagement is not going to plan RETREAT.
With practise and discipline a full squad can move almost anywhere undetected. Problems arise when you get bogged down in an unnecessary firefight, hanging around a destroyed cache or trying to revive someone. Be prepared to sacrifice troops for the sake of the objective.
Build OFFENSIVE FOBs when you are moving to a cache or known enemy objective. Use 1 crate and hide the FOB as best you can. Be prepared to sacrifice it.
Build DEFENSIVE FOBs when you need intel or to defend. Be sure to take down limited assets; AA & TOW or mortars when you abandon it.

Summary:
Coms & weapons discipline essential.
Movement: Speed & stealth whenever possible.
Squad understands roles/pairing.
Clear mission goals.
Squad understands route to and from target.

As SL your biggest challenge is communication with the squad. With a new squad, I start by building a defensive FOB and holding it. I then kick the ones who get bored and wander off. Don't let squadmembers dictate tactics, that will undermine your authority as SL. Maybe begin with a 4- or 5-man squad, or if you have Orford or Snips or someone, let them look after 1/2 the squad.

Ivan's hit the nail on the head - Momentum.

After a while you develop an understanding of when to move. You realise when there is a lull in enemy forces. You take that time to move your squad.

Good Team communication and organisation leads to momentum. That in turn will overcome the enemy every time.

To add to Bangs point....

The only way (or atleast the most effective) to get a team organised is through....


MUMBLE!

ivandobsky wrote:For INFANTRY SLs:
Don't be afraid to kick people from your squad if they are not following orders, even *NwA* admins (especially Vince)

Fixed >

I'm a particular offender for back-seat squad leading when squad leaders either don't have a clear plan or don't tell us what their plan is, communication is key.

Dear Ivan !

i would like to point out that i didn't say "let your squad members shoot at anything" what i actually said was give the order "weapons free" frequently, there is a huge difference, one is anarchy the other is ordered aggression.

the idea that you can simply bypass the enemy is to underestimate the enemy.

there are times when quiet is better than noisy but as a (usually) squad member rather than squad leader i would say that the most common mistake made by Sl's is the thought that being stealthy is how PR is played, this mistake is often / usually the little bit just before the squad is wiped out.

also the idea that moving for moving sake is strange, moving without a plan will surely end in the death of the squad.

moving is best done when the enemy is dead after all.

some more general tips;

one tip i would give to prospective SL's is don't be afraid to get on the squad about cheap deaths, people (particularly new players) will often fire then try to get to cover, as a squad leader it's part of your job to try and reverse this, place your squad in cover constantly and get your squad to appreciate this, they will stay alive a lot longer.

as a squad leader you will only ever be as good as the personal skills of your squad, try to work within these limits, it should be fairly obvious for instance whether your squad is any good at CQB (most aren't)

as a squad leader you should be looking at your map every few seconds, the map is the best friend you've got.

get in mumble squad leader channel and encourage other SL's to do so then actually use it (most don't)

speed

Movement, Cover, Movement, Cover

Just remember them to words when Leading your men into battle...

Dont have them free running from corner to corner.

When i first started playing PR i never wanted to Squad lead, But now its my No.1 Role...

Best advise i can give you Ghost is to keep squading up with the good SL's

Bemetson , Hitman , Sug , etc etc... And Observe what there doing.

Dear Speeed,
You mis-read my post please refer to the part regarding clear mission goals &
route to and from target.
When in hostile territory speed of movement & stealth give you the element of surprise. The key to overcoming enemy contact.
Please read:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Art-War-Sun-Tzu/dp/1599869772
if you don't agree with standard martial philosophy! :study:

When i played,, play, used to, whatever

I took aspects of Vandals Plan, Prepare, execute

Bangs movement but steady progress

and a few things like IVAN's MG doing all the cover work, My own grab a crate build, move etc

You'll pick it up as you go along mate, im back in pr from tonight, just remind me i posted here and i'll happily squad up with you, follow you to death or glory.

one thing im 50/50 on is what we used to call a chineese parliment in Army Cadets (not THE army i do know the difference before any ex soliders get there backs up! ) where everyone has an input and you pick the choice, sometimes it works well, for instance player B might of seen a route SL hasnt, but player C might know its a enemy hot spot, Information is power, too much info is overflow

Prior Preparation Prevents Piss Poor Perfomance, done be afraid to stop, think, regroup, retreat if needy, think what could a fob do here, is there anyone with trucks, or do i send my dead guy to respawn main, could a few cas rounds allow me to move back to get higher ground

Like the others said, alot of people are keyboard warriors, if they got crap attitude to the way YOU lead YOUR squad (except obviously like taking challenger II through basrah high street) then boot them, let them go else where!

Good luck mate, like i said, i'll join ya for a crack

But remember, when it comes to the execution, even the best laid plans can go to sh*t.

Be calm, think through whats happening and react accordingly. Don't be afraid to fall back, re-group and try again. Fight the opposition on your terms, don't get sucked into their kind of engagement.

A couple of things.

Try to divide the sq into 2 fireteams. Have an experienced guy lead the other ft.

Then when engageing, ft 1 provides suppressive fire, while ft flanks.

You dont have to be in the action to do this, just be in the ft1, and let the FT2 leader do his job.

I often see ppl try to shot to kill, its way more effective, to use suppresive fire, even though you dont have a target.

Movement is so important. If the enemy does not know where you are they cant shot you.

Also, remember when using fobs. Use them offensively as ivan said.
You can bld the HMG up to 200 meters from the fob itself.

Ive begun on maps like Lashkar, to get a fob up on a mountain, just to get 2 HMG's up that can suppress the hell out of anything from a distance.

Again here the key is movement. But here you restrict the enemy from moving freely.

Try to think out of the box. Dont just spawn and run towards the enemy.
Using an 10 ekstra minutes to get into position can be the difference between win or lose.

Have your sm call out targets. I just hate it when ppl start firing without saying a word.

dear Mr Dobsky,

yes in can be frustrating when someone doesn't bother to read the words you have so lovingly crafted can't it (loool)

like Nayt i was also in the ACF where i reached Sgt which involved completing an abbreviated version of the regular army section leaders course, which you were then expected to use in full scale exercises (often with the regular army) ;this is what i learnt

the main order used in infantry engagements in 'advance to combat'

1. you move in a fairly direct line until the enemy is seen or until you are shot at

2. you assess the enemy strength and whereabouts

3. you set up your heavy weapons platoon in a central (facing the enemy) location

4. you create some form of confusion (usually a smoke screen or repeated suppressive fire) in-between the support platoon and the enemy

5. rifle platoons then out flank the enemy on the side where there is least enemy resistance or has geographical advantage (cover, height etc)

6. secure area.

ambush and sneaking about unseen may have worked in iron age China or modern day insurgency for that matter but that isn't how modern infantry works in general.
I do realise that PR is a game and tactics must be modified in relation to the numbers available to the teams.
I see many things in gaming as metaphor, the medic, re-spawning etc etc is a metaphor for a much bigger force than is available to server limitations for example, so with that understood the same principles outlined above can be implemented but with much smaller numbers.

1-3 same as above

4. get your LMG / DMR in a genuinely advantageous place and get them to shoot most if not all their ammunition at the enemy

5. flank the enemy with the rest of the squad using a route that is most advantageous as concerns cover whilst the enemy concerns itself with your support section.

6. same as above

before people misread anything, yes seeing and being unseen are often very important, that's why they wear cammo and not red tunics any more, but good cover is always better than camouflage when the shooting starts and the shooting will always start earlier than you would wish because the enemy aren't blind most of the time.
the above will always work better with more numbers, if one whole squad can provide covering suppressive fire so much the better (use mumble)

more general tips,

communicate always, if you talk a lot your squad will talk as well, if you stop talking so will they.

speed

Can't argue with that buddy

Yo, good thread guys good info

Haven't managed to read all of it yet cos theirs loads but ill give you some tips.

Situation stuff like assaulting and attacking is best learnt as you go along. Im not gonna give you tips on what to do in certain situations but ill give you common sense tips that might appear minor but infact they are key in understanding the flow and pace of the game.

Ok number 1. Your gonna make mistakes, understand that your gonna make alot of mistakes when you first become an SL. This is paramount in learning from you experiences and improving SLing.

number 2. Look at every fighting individually and work out why you died/failed.

number 3. If something didn't work right the first time it isn't going to work again.

number 4. Working with other squads will increase your effectiveness many times over. 12 friendlies vs 6 enemies is very favourable always.

number 5. You have so much more freedom than you think you do on a map.

number 6. You have so much more time than you think you do. People always into firefights and the guns in PR are incredibly accurate when you are stationary for more than 5 seconds.

number 7. The AR is an awesome killing machine. He is the most important member of the party and will save everyones arse tenfold just by covering/suppressing.

number 8. Retreat often! If your loosing guys and theres alot of enemies fall back. No sense wasting tickets.

number 9. Keep things simple that goes for everything. Comms, Tactics, Orders.

number 10. Practice! No one is good at anything without putting the hours in!

edit: all of ivans stuff I agree with!! he knows!

Hey,

Just a few pointers:

-The most important thing to stress and encourage is aggression and individual initiative. This will allow you to focus on leading the squad, especially when you're under fire. As a SL your individual decision making should follow OODA (Google it, and read the book: Leadership and training for the fight).

-Keep the tactics simple. Fancy tactics and formations do not work in a firefight, unless you've played with the same members many times before and you've drilled them.

-Keep your orders simple, and don't micromanage everything. If you're giving too detailed instructions and orders to the squad all the time, they will become dependent on those orders. This will lead to lack of individual initiative among the members, which is extremely important in a firefight. For example: You get shot as a SL -> You don't have the full picture of the situation because you're lying on the ground -> PPL are expecting orders, because they've become dependent on them -> PPL freeze -> PPL die. If however there is time to give more detailed instructions (for example: when you're defending and waiting for the enemy), then it's good to do so.

-Check the map frequently, and plan your move ahead accordingly. This is one reason why you should have someone else as a pointman. I've died hundreds of times while looking at the map screen up in the front.

-Try different styles of leadership and tactics. Make constant evaluation of yourself as a SL. Play as a regular squad member occationally and compare yourself to other leaders. Find your weaknessess and try to get rid off them.

totally agree with u paavo. let me contribute here with my tips for insurgency:
- 1) Actually the hardest thing for any squad leader is to keep your team moving to the cache location and encourage them to stay focused only on the objective. People tend to fall into defensive when they reach cache loc and this gets them overhelmed by waves of enemies spawning on nearby hideouts. So keeping momentum and initiative is the key + dont let them shoot enemies that are not between you and the objective.
- 2) try to group up with some other squad and strike one cache location together. Unfortunately multiple squad teamwork still doesnt work very much. teams are scattered across the whole map and squads are fighting their own wars So when your squad dies trying to take out the cache you look at the map and you usually see noone around then it makes you shout "where the f***ck is everyone? "
hups and I feel like a clever asshole again:)

By the way, eliminating one's weaknessess is very difficult. It takes concious effort, and lots of trial and error. For example: I'm still struggling with giving clear and simple orders, which is why I perform bad under stress. My speech is too fast and I talk too much. Oh yeah, and I curse a lot when things go bad..

hello Mr Paavo, you must be doing something right, your squad leading is ok in my book and very often your the only other person in SL channel !!!! nice to see you on the forums.

Hey Paavo Good game on Dragon fly the other night Mate!

Next time am on ill jump in your squad, see if i pick anything new up from you! =]

One thing I have learn't. If people are not following your orders, shout at them or just kick them from your SQ. Removing these problematic players from your SQ makes it a lot easier and less stressful.

Oh, and people have a tendency to bunch up while as a SQ. Keep reminding them to spread out as it will make both your job (and the medics) a lot easier should they go down.

Last thing, if you do end up in a firefight. Try to return more fire than them!!! Having an AR in your SQ is mandatory in my books xD.

Nice round on Dragon fly today paavo.
And Dobbeh...Im afraid your AR is gonny get HAT sn1p3d by unnamed noob.
Could`t resist, could you? Why are you still reading this? Want to know name of the noob? Well...you made it this far, that noob is named Tarranauha20. Now Who is that? Yeah, thats me. Prepare to get pwned by my 1337 guerrilla tactics.

Dobbeh wrote:One thing I have learn't. If people are not following your orders, shout at them or just kick them from your SQ. Removing these problematic players from your SQ makes it a lot easier and less stressful.

This is such a great point that I'm going to reiterate it.

If people are causing you problems, give them 1 (or if you're feeling nice, 2) warning/s, then kick them. The time you spend trying to get them to follow your orders could be better spent organising the squad members who are actually listening to you.

KingPaavo wrote:By the way, eliminating one's weaknessess is very difficult. It takes concious effort, and lots of trial and error. For example: I'm still struggling with giving clear and simple orders, which is why I perform bad under stress. My speech is too fast and I talk too much. Oh yeah, and I curse a lot when things go bad..

So do I, mate. Unfortunatly, I somtimes forget to mute myself then and all get my rage...

I'd like to say something about multitasking in PR. Multitasking is directly related to situational awareness, which is critical for any kind of success in PR. I often find myself at the very peak of my multitasking capacity, especially when I'm SL. The things I might have to do at the same time:

- Engage enemies
- Give simple and clear orders
- Check the map
- Communicate with other SL / Commander
- Try to predict enemy movements

Sounds complicated? Add two wounded and/or completely new PR players as squad members to the mix, and I quarantee you'll be overwhelmed. The most difficult thing to do is to focus on the correct thing at the correct time. Avoiding distractions and useless info is crucial, which makes communication discipline extremely important.

BTW. I'm gonna devote this week to the improvement of my constant bad temper.

I'm gonna devote this week to the improvement of my constant bad temper.

The bane of SL's everywhere.

lets work together come on come on lets work together

together we will stand every boy, girl, woman and man

You no what i have learned! never invite other good squad leaders into your squad.. NEVER fking works lol i dont no why it just doesn't.

Back seat SLs!

Only when they take it too seriously scotty

You guys ever thought of appointing a radio man?

For example. Squad has over watch on a platoon of enemy tanks, SL has marked the target on the map and has lazed. However, his attention is suddenly taken up by a squad of enemy infantry.

He could ask his radioman to continue comms with the CAS element, while he directs his squad to suppress the enemy infantry. This would mean appointing a second squad member to the SL channel to cover comms when required.

I've thought of this, but I rarely squad lead. If i join a pubbers squad I usually hop in the SL channel and sort of act as radio man (assuming SL isnt in SL channel already) passing on messages both ways.

they just need to cool down, you can't get mad if somebody is literally trying to play Call of duty team death match and gets your team killed by giving away your pos to 32 enemy...

lets face it its a game, just tell it like it is and don't get angry (i'm not toing to name names

I've radio-manned for Alchy I think it was as he was finding SL channel a bit hectic.

Jay Scott wrote:You no what i have learned! never invite other good squad leaders into your squad.. NEVER fking works i dont no why it just doesn't.

Yes, Scotty. I've had experience of that too.

Squad leading, and leadership in general is not something that is generic to all people. Every one has their own unique method to leadership and command. My best tip is to lead and learn from your mistakes, hone in your own unique style of command and find the best way to get the job done.

Though, as a generic rule, always urge squad members and other squad leaders ( YAY FOR MUMBLE) to communicate often, move from cover to cover and not to MONG it in general.

Could always take my approach -

'Right. We'll attaaaaaaaack *places marker* here. Any ideas?'

Protip - Let the people who should be SL's do the SL'ing for you. And they rate your ideas.

capitan wrote: If i join a pubbers squad I usually hop in the SL channel and sort of act as radio man (assuming SL isnt in SL channel already) passing on messages both ways.

Doing same here.

Further tips from me:
-do briefings
-listen to your squad (i have to practice that sum moar )
-keep it simple
-keep ya squad together: "divide et impera" mostly goes wrong. for that you need a good leader who is a good follower @ same time (like bem). but theese guys are more rare than a good SL

i sum it up in 3 points really -
1, Kick the fool's who think they're always better than you and think they can tell u how to squad lead,
2, Kill lots of enemy
3, Keep things exciting for your squad and always try be on the front line, because if theirs lots of action your squad will be happy xD

Ive been looking through this and whilst a lot of good points are raised, I just cannot follow these guidelines because of my mindset,



My objective is that my whole squad has a laugh and a good time, whether were troll strolling across jabal or we just got tanked on Iron eagle, I like the idea of sitting with the squad and telling funny stories to lighten the mood and similar ideas as that, and I let people know by naming the squad something ridiculous such as:

[Pinkie Pie, Rainbow Dash, Lyra, Luna Swag, Octavia etc]



To boot, I let the first infantry mumble squad get created to skim off all the tactical hard-heads that come on so I can get the cream of the fun underneath, people who play PR because its a game and not a mil-sim.



I'd love to discuss SL'ing with somebody, or to sit down and perhaps explain my thoughts and processes.



Common Activities my squad enjoys :

Looking at the map and laughing at the other squads

Asking where in the world are we

Looking at the funny geometries on some of our kits

Considering walking to the next flag at some 400m away

Walking to the next flag (400)+-m away

I always walk most of the time, if im leading a squad we man up and power walk there, apc's and jeeps just attract attention, i like to be sneaky sneaky ninja style

Chris_Kampfgurke wrote:

-keep ya squad together: "divide et impera" mostly goes wrong. for that you need a good leader who is a good follower @ same time (like bem). but theese guys are more rare than a good SL

I don't agree with this . I find moving spaced out is an important stage to win a firefight . I do find flanking pretty successfull as well .

Bullet what you say there makes me laugh! Today you did exactly that to me.. making me rage quit!

How to Squad lead..? PUT THE HOURS IN!

BXV-[Tr] wrote:

Chris_Kampfgurke wrote:

-keep ya squad together: "divide et impera" mostly goes wrong. for that you need a good leader who is a good follower @ same time (like bem). but theese guys are more rare than a good SL

I don't agree with this . I find moving spaced out is an important stage to win a firefight . I do find flanking pretty successfull as well .

It depends on the situation. Sometimes it is better to keep the squad together, like raiding building complexes or split the squad to two fireteams to efficiently attack the enemy from two differen directions.

But keep the good hints and tips coming out y'all squad leaders! The more hint & tips we get the more we learn

Jay Scott wrote:Bullet what you say there makes me laugh! Today you did exactly that to me.. making me rage quit!

How to Squad lead..? PUT THE HOURS IN!

Lol Scotty i told you not to go down the stairs first if you are squadleading but you didn't listen
Then u got stuck in the door frame and the medic couldn't revive you then our medic was out in the open and got killed and because i was covering 5 different entraces with a pkm - it was kinda hard to stay alive!

And if you cover the floor below your squad in a building and u can cover both stairs with no chance of friendly fire with just 1 guy instead of using 2 like you did, you have that extra firepower plus less risk of tk's. but that was just my 2 cence ;D

And i wasn't telling you what to do i was just suggesting an alternative method that would benefit the squad then u raged because i was right, but im not gloating about it - it could've worked differently if infact we did use my tactic instead of yours.